I have been following cdacs in some northern counties especially Eau Claire county central forest and they are not using metrics or science to justify big increases in anterless tags. Just using some anecdotal statements from the forestry rep and dnr biologist. These tags are not necessary and are ruining deer hunting especially on public land. The Natural Resource Board needs to override these unjustified increases. Is any one else noticing these ongoing trends with the cdacs and dnr?
CDACs Up North Not Using Metrics or Science To Justify Increase of Antlerless Tags
From the Vernon County 2021 CDAC minutes: Many of the same comments we have heard before. Public land - people wanted fewer tags, but we can’t regulate them right now, only the ones that are purchased.
Justification to increase tags: We changed the amount of public land bonus permits to 300 because 250 always sold out and this will allow to reach our goal.
THEY DO NOT LISTEN!!!
The CDAC's in Vernon and Crawford county do not listen to the majority if the public comments that come in. The same biologist covers both of these counties and should be fired imo. Two years ago he recommended to increase the amount of bonus tags to help bring in more money. Two years ago Crawford county got hit hard with EHD, no response. Probably 95% of the comments a few years ago did not support the 10 day holiday doe only hunt, but they went ahead and approved it anyway. The system is a joke and needs to be gutted.
As for doe tags, I have mixed emotions. I dont believe tags should be given out north of HWY 8 to anyone, not even kids for a few more years. In west Price co. the deer numbers were coming back in 2018. A bad winter and back down. There are very few deer on the public land in west Price co. and the Flambeau River State Forest. . Even the cut over public land has very little browsed tops of the popple shoots, almost no tracks , droppings or rubs. As for Washington co. where I have been doing more deer hunting on public land down here cause it makes more sense, I see more deer , but 3 doe tags for bow and 3 for gun, means you can shoot 6 does . That is simply too many deer per hunter. However, so many get killed on the highway , it makes some sense. On the other hand again, just getting one doe a year on this over hunted public land is a task. In 10 yrs I got 1 buck , 2 does with my bow and 1doe with my gun, in 10 seasons of hunting it hard. I think we should go to 1 doe per season and be done . Yes, we would have more road kills , however, we would see a few more deer when we are in the woods. I must say though, it really is a shame seeing so many dead deer on the highway 41 /45 from Germantown to Fond Du Lac.
The problem lies in that you are listening and considering the dnrs failed math and likely already issuing too many tags. Letting their flawed numbers influence you. And feel like you're doing a good thing by issuing fewer tags than dnr is recommending. DNR is also not looking at metrics, relying on only a flawed formula and forestry reps claiming everything is being overvbrowsed. Hunter demand for tags and whether it is consistent or not from year to year should have nothing to do with amount of tags issued. Real metrics determines whether to issue tags , no tags or more tags, less tags.
The math provided by DNR says we need to issue more tags. Thousands more. We do not.
We have limited options for controlling our deer population. Issuing more tags will not result in more deer being harvested. Customer demand for tags is rather consistent year after year.
Access has a greater impact on deer hunting than the number of tags sold.
Whose math says you should issue more tags? DNR math? Look at metrics such a what the buck kill is doing, car collisions, winter severity, crop damage, fawn recruitment, etc. Just dont look at dnr math which goes by a highly flawed sak formula. Looks like you have too many tags issued by hunter demand if by your own admission hunter success is very low. Logic and metrics would tell you there aren't that many deer then right? Why do a lot of cdacs and dnr always want to issue more tags than needed or that the metrics are telling you. I just don't get this thought process unless you are shooting for a super low deer population where hunters see few or any deer and end up quitting hunting which is happening more and more in this state.
My point is there is only so much demand for deer tags in our county. The math says we should offer more tags. But we do not. We do not flood the county with extra deer tags. If we did, no one would buy them.
Hunter success is less than 25% in our county, so even with the tags we sell, harvest is quite low. Hunters with access to deer fill tags. Hunters with limited access to deer have difficulty filling tags or even seeing deer.
It is feast or famine. The determining factor is bunter access.
Issuing tags based on hunter demand whether they are needed or not is absolutely rediculous. That is not managing deer in any scientific manner. A lot of hunters would shoot as many deer as tags they can buy no matter what the deer population is. why do you think deer hunting sucks in northern half of the state on public land?. Because the dnr sold thousands of tags over the years that were not justified. Now hunting totally sucks on public and often private land up north. You are repeating the dnrs rediculous deer management by issuing too many tags. It is not about selling tags based on hunter demand. If we use your logic there would be no game left. What if you issued turkey tags or bear tags based on hunter demand essentially have thousands more tags out there. Don't you think hunting would suck for those too. Bases on your logic we should have tons of tags for everything. What next no bag limits because that is what hunters are demanding? Again you are using no science, metrics or logic to manage deer, exactly like the dnr, no idea what wildlife management is. Just sell the tags and don't worry about the quality of the hunt or the future of deer hunting. Sell tags based on hunter demand is laughable. Maybe you should read the cdac governance how the process is supposed to work by looking at real metrics.
Trouter, your last post indicates just the opposite of the point your trying to make. Hunter demand should not be part of the equation. It is not part of the metrics. Based on the information you have provided on the process in your county, it appears to me that even with a low deer herd and metrics that support no antlerless tags, you would issue a number the same as years past because hunter demand is the overriding factor.
Littleluck, we issue tags based on customer demand. Hunter demand for tags is watched closely. There is only so much demand for tags. So we issue as many tags as hunters historically ask for.
We are in the deer management business, not the tag selling business.