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1/5/13 @ 5:49 PM
ORIGNAL POST
Plmlk
Brent Hess
MEMBER since 12/18/07
Ice-

Switches don't typically have neutrals, as if you switched a hot to a neutral you would create a dead short. Extremely unlikely your switch has a neutral.

If you notice the center terminals on your switch are connected together. My guess is that this is power to the switch, as well as a binding terminal. Meaning power comes into the switch, and then goes somewhere else. Are these the brown and blue wires????

The single terminals (white and black I'm guessing) are switched power, one going to the fan, and one going to the light. You'll have to check the schematic on your range, but I would bet you lunch that the black and white are for the fan and oven light. Which one I'm not certain. You should be able to jump the brown wire to the black wire and see what comes on the fan or the light. Then you have your answer. Make sense? Let me know if it doesn't.

It would help if you told me what wires are on which posts.

The Woodlands Resort
(262) 661-3968
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7/23/19 @ 1:01 PM
BâssÂddîçt ©¸
BâssÂddîçt ©¸
MEMBER since

Connector if the connector is just pushed straight up at a 90 it's better to be laying flat

It's kind of odd that someone would installed it that way

7/23/19 @ 12:53 PM
the_dude
the_dude
User since 1/10/03

Wow, BA that's some pretty good investigative work. I just zoomed in on several originals I took and I don't believe that wire is broke.  I think it is angle of the picture and the connector is bent towards the camera.  It is certainly a connection worth checking though.


7/23/19 @ 12:43 PM
BâssÂddîçt ©¸
BâssÂddîçt ©¸
MEMBER since

Notice the the wire broken off ...circled in red 

7/23/19 @ 10:17 AM
Dave (Golden)
Dave (Golden)
MEMBER since 6/22/01

Dude.. you are taking me back to my past.

The thing you are referring to as a "switch" is a reversing motor contactor, similar device to the first image I attached. They are using a NEMA rated device designed for a 3 phase motor on a single phase motor, which is fine. Those things are pretty bullet proof. If that contactor is not operating the first thing I would check would be the starter coils. They can fail, they are the component that draws the contactor closed. The coil is the part on the contactor with the red lettering on it, with the two wires connected to them. If you can remove the wires and check the resistance of those coils it can indicate whether they failed. I am not sure what the coil resistance should be, I could guess, but the simple test would be if the meter reads infinity or a very high resistance the coil has failed. This might be why it worked in one direction and not the other.

That reversing contactor can easily be replaced with a less expense type of device, similar to the second photo if it has failed.

I don't know what that thing is above the contactor, but suspect it might be a timer of some sort. Any part numbers on it?

The third picture is a toggle switch made by Allen-Bradley (Rockwell Automation).. I worked for them for 40 years prior to going to Amazon and to be honest, that does not even look familiar to me, which is really strange. It should have a "catalog number" one it, I suspect it will start with "802C", if you can share that info I can make a call and understand how it works inside of recommend a replacement.

To be continued..


7/22/19 @ 2:48 PM
the_dude
the_dude
User since 1/10/03

Wow, I'm not sure where time is going...

Anyway, I finally remembered to take some pictures of the set up of the winch for the lift.  

Pic 1 is the "guts" of the operation.  When manually engaging the "switch" on the right, the cart goes down.  The one of the left and it goes up.  At least it used to.  It worked the first time I engaged the "switch" and started to go down.  The second time, nothing.  So now it appears it doesn't work at all?

Pic 2 is the actual winch motor.

Pic 3 is the switch that is connected to the cable.  When it worked, you'd pull and release the cord, the winch would start in one direction.  Pull again to stop.  Pull a 3 time and you would start in the opposite direction.

Any help anyone could or would provide would be greatly appreciated. 

4/5/19 @ 11:12 AM
Dave (Golden)
Dave (Golden)
MEMBER since 6/22/01

Ya.. pretty basic limit switch..

I bet the switch the cable is connected to is also just a "pull" limit switch, doubt it is some type of "mode" switch. You will see these pull limit switches on doors in a manufacturing environment. The switch is mounted to the ceiling with a pull cord attached, yank to open, yank to close.. The up down stop functionality is most likely simple logic performed by some relay logic...

4/5/19 @ 11:05 AM
the_dude
the_dude
User since 1/10/03

Awesome, thanks for all the help!  My brother has a place up there as well and is a bit handier on the electrical stuff, so with your guidance and his help maybe we can get her running again!

Dave - If you look at the picture of the cart, you can see one of the limit switches on the ground.  Close to what you pictured, only older!  

4/5/19 @ 10:06 AM
madforlabs
User since 12/20/12

Dude, send me a photo of your "spring switch" and I can likely help you out with a replacement.

I'm guessing most electricians wouldn't touch a lift application but there might be some 1 man independent contractors that wouldn't know enough to walk away.

4/5/19 @ 5:55 AM
Dave (Golden)
Dave (Golden)
MEMBER since 6/22/01

I assume the two auto switches you are referring to are actually limit switches, which makes sense .. similar to the photo... I also would guess that you have some type of a controller for the motor, if I were designing it I would use a component class drive, or some type of in-expense soft starter (commonly used on pumps / compressors and such) so it doesn't jerk to on start-up and stopping.

4/5/19 @ 5:35 AM
the_dude
the_dude
User since 1/10/03

There is no switch at the bottom.  The line that runs all the way along the track has to be pulled to stop it.  That said, the cable is just long enough to reach the bottom, so if it isn’t stopped, it just starts going back up the hill.  There are two auto switches at the top.  The first stops it right at the wooden platform.  The second is basically an emergency stop that must be there in case the first fails.  When that second one is tripped, all power is cut.  You have to manually lift the cart off the switch to get it to move again.

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