I hunt where they have a minimum 4 pt side to be legal (SE Minnesota) but have not seen much improvement other than many basket deer. I am against antler point restrictions figuring a deer is a trophy to different people for different reasons and why should we legally change that.
That said, wondering if there is a better way. Alternating years-one year-4pt minimum, next year, smaller only, that way these basket deer survive to get big.
Thoughts?
If you want a bigger buck you have to put in your time.If you want even bigger you have to put in even more time. There are big deer in all areas of Wisconsin trail cameras can prove that.
We are loosing hunters every year.My thoughts are that we will be coming into some very good times if you stick with it.
Michigan has a good 2 buck system.Wisconsin could model a system from them. But I think a 1 buck system DNR would loose some revenue then would want to raise price of license.
But with restrictions come some side effects.When will enough be enough. Guys shooting nice deer will want even nicer deer. It would lead to more "ME Deer My Deer" .
Many great comments and thoughts on this thread.
For context: I am a member of a CDAC and hunt SE MN.
My thoughts:
APR has been accepted and liked by the vast majority of the hunters in the area I hunt. I think APR would work in a few counties in southern and SW Wisconsin, areas similar to where it has been implemented in MN.
One buck per person would be a step forward. Party drives, no opinion. For the meat hunters who tell me they can't feed their families without liberal issuance of tags, this is what I tell them, heard of grocery stores.
I am troubled by how management strategies and opinions are traveling down a road of Public land versus Private land. I think we are selling ourselves short of anything less than a quality product for both types of land.
I see something that has been lost is the happiness/joy of harvesting a deer, whether a doe, spike, or wallhanger. Also, what happened to being happy for the other guy/gal.
Brother, I spent the first 20 years of my hunting career hunting public land in Marinette county. Nothing better than 20 guys pushing every inch of public land every day of the season. Never mind all the scouting you did and plans you made but now every deer in the unit is on high alert or sitting on some private sanctuary. That's ok, cause your crew had a good time and took endless crappy shots at running deer. I know......your crew does it right, the safe way. We used to do small pushes on private land year after year, I know the drill. I was just giving my opinion how to increase the hunting experience on public land. Do what you will, I don't give a rats ass. The hunters sick of turd hunters found a way to get access to private land. Shoot what you want, hunt how you want, but stop complaining when you're the problem. My biggest buck was from from public land by the way.
Hunting in an area where different crews literally wait in line to drive out the same chunk of public land day after day, I hate them. However, I don't know if necessarily outlawing deer drives is a smart move. I would much rather support the 1 buck per year (regardless of weapon), and eliminating group bagging (yes, hard to enforce - but already illegal for archery season).
However, outlawing deer drives opening weekend would be a great way to ease tensions for the guy who climbs into a treestand before light opening morning, only to have drivers from a crew drive right under their stand at the opening bell and ruining their hunt for the day. Been there, it sucks.
I understand the tradition, hanging out and shooting deer, but I really don't agree with going out on public and raping it. Take your 10 buddies and drive your own dang private land. Like i said, abusing the resources. I can't do that crap. The public was there for me when i was in my teens and in college. It was free and gave me the opportunity to get in the woods. I couldn't misuse it. That's just my take on gun hunting and driving. If you couldn't drive, the droves of shooters would go there.
I know a guy that dropped his rifle from the tree. They were standing around the parking lot and a fawn is peeling across the field. He says, I'll see if my scope is on. Kills this little thing and then no one wanted it. He ended up finding someone to take it...what he did there are no words for besides irresponsible. "hahaha, I guess my scope is ok". BS
I can't gun hunt anymore, it just makes me angry. I go fishing and just listen to the army bang away.
I think that is pretty common, hunt your own property for the first weekend and then go piss pound the public the second weekend. I see that quite a bit but more in the farmland areas. Not so much in the northwoods although I do see some drives from time to time. I don't even care about full fledged drives though, just guys still hunting or slowly moving is all it takes. I may even do that this year, I've shot deer before doing that. Walk a little, sit, walk a little, sit.
I feel like deer numbers aren't too bad on public areas, the main problem is that people push the deer out quickly, which is more the overcrowding. Many times I'll go back after a season and see deer again, where there were none 2 weeks prior. Its no different than guys over hunting private land. If you had a 40 and had 8 guys walk into it every day, it wouldn't take long for it to suck.
Well there is a reason why people need to drive deer. By gun season they are so educated and pressured. then on top of that, many guys that hunt public during gun are in there all day friday hanging stands. There is little to no natural movement so driving is pretty essential to get them moving.
Edit: I see lake shiner beat me to the pressure and guys in there the day prior.
That said, there is a reason why there are so few deer on public lands. I can't tell you how many guys I know that take 20 dudes and go push a public spot. It gets beat on so bad that the population takes a hit. It's like kicking someone when he's down. Most of these guys have hunted their private for opening weekend and don't even need meat. they are there for the shooting. I don't agree with it but whatever floats your boat. I'd go fishing before i'd put on 4 miles trying to kill a fawn with a rifle. For that reason, I think drives are bad for public lands, people abuse them. I don't hunt public much and I don't gun hunt, so personally I don't care. I do think deer drives are where the damage is done and though i don't participate in rifle season, i'm assuming there are many private lands that partake as well.
Its funny that deer drives are mentioned. I truly believe that a big part of why less big bucks are shot in the northwoods is because there are less drivers than years ago. Now the big deer figure out what is going on right away as people flood the woods a few days before. They sit tight during the day and then all the hunters sit tight in their stands. Creates a stalemate situation and only the small bucks move because they are dumb. I see it every year on my camera. I could remove the dates and figure out just by the pictures when gun season is about to start. When someone ends up shooting a nice buck the story either goes 'it was following a doe' or 'someone jumped it to me'. Damn near every time.
Joe Hunter used to care about others. That mentality went away and the 'my deer' one took over. When I first started, people were much nicer than they are today. I don't think people had deer on such a pedestal back then. That's another thing you have to remember here. To some people they are just deer, like they are just ducks or they are just rabbits. There was a funny video done about some guys turkey hunting as if they were deer hunting. Guy draws on a bird, "No no no, don't shoot that. Only a 3 year old bird, we shoot 5 year old birds." Triple beard walks in, "No no no, that's only 4 years old, give him a year. Good pass, good pass." "I have hundreds of pictures of that bird right there, good potential." Puts the craziness of deer into perspective in a funny way.
"You want to improve hunting opportunities for everyone, eliminate deer drives on public land, no group bagging, 1 buck per hunter per year. "
Can you give me 1 legit reason for the deer drives? (eliminating) Do you have ANY experience with deer drives or does the phrase hurt your feelings?
I do deer drives, that's what I enjoy. We make drives for 9 straight days, put many miles on a day. Personally, I see an average half dozen deer a season (others in the group see a couple more, other see a couple less) but yet, I still love doing it. In the country we hunt, most sitters wouldn't see a deer if not for someone moving the couple deer that are left up here around in public. Just another person who can't see outside their box...me me me...Don't worry, your not alone. Plenty of em out there wearing blinders.
People seem to want the rules changed to fit their little hunting area. Maybe its time to have different rules for each township? Wouldn't that be entertaining!!!
Sounds like good ole Ronny made it back to LL or at least one of his followers.
I love how everyone thinks because land is private it is great. LB was spot on about most private land being over hunted. Every T,D, and Harry is now a big buck hunter and over hunts the crap out of their land. Those who had great hunting on smaller tracks are now forced to leave them alone until the rut as every property line is lined with wannabes smacking black racks and throwing buck bombs every weekend of the fall. Some of the best hunting opportunities are still on public land during bow season. Yes gun season is a disaster but that is merely because Joe Hunter does not give a crap about his fellow sportsman.
You want to improve hunting opportunities for everyone, eliminate deer drives on public land, no group bagging, 1 buck per hunter per year. Antler restrictions are a lost cause, I would rather see education and propaganda pushed that helps hunters understand the benefits of letting deer reach full maturity. A mature buck has more meat than a young one, right? The antler size is an added bonus. I would be fine with draw only units for bucks, especially if land owners got preference based on acreage. You don't care about antlers, hunt in a general draw area.
Rumor on the street is a buck in Illinois was killed that green scored in the low 340's, waiting for the drying period before details are released to the public. Just a rumor but stay tuned.
I'd be okay with a Doe Only season in my county. I don't get hot and bothered not shooting a buck. If you set unrealistic goals hunting in wisconsin you will be let down in most areas. I love to hunt, I don't gauge success on kills or bucks that died. I'd be all for doe only. if you want meat, you have to kill a doe. Sad thing is it's all about revenue again. I'd hunt, you'd hunt....but many would not. Sad...but it's the truth. WI is NOT a trophy state in 80%. Western, SW wisconsin and pockets here and there have big tracks and well managed land. 80% of wisconsin would be angry because they can't kill the first animal with a rack. Some how people get off on saying "I got my buck"...
Ihookem, I do hunt in Shawano County. If you go back and read some of my posts, you will see that I don't favor any kind of restrictions on bucks in the northern forest. Too many things like predators, rougher winters, poorer habitat, smaller carrying capacity that make any restrictions not make sense. Take the top 10 or so counties that already have lots of QDM on a voluntary basis and work with them. Just like some lakes are ripe for trophy regulations for fish, so are some counties for deer. There are a few different tastes on how people hunt, so I think there should be some different regulations to match, but only in areas where it makes sense. If you want to pursure large small mouth bass, walleye, etc, there are lakes that are managed for that. If you want to pursue mature whitetails, good luck. Shouldn't be that way.
Also, I wouldn't mind a doe only season in Shawano County as was proposed for Waupaca a year or two ago. Most of the QDM guys don't mind either, its best for the resource overall to balance it out. It was your PLH type hunters that whined the most in Waupaca County. Those who would rather shoot a 115# spike rather than a 120# doe, but will be sure to tell you that you can't eat the horns. I don't know if I would want it to go season after season, though. That was my big problem with EAB. Our group and most in our area were already shooting does, so after it ramped up in our area with EAB we were having some population issues. We quit shooting that last year as we determined the resource could not handle it. The 4 or 5 years in a row they had was just abuse of that tool which is why they no longer have it available. Also why I would take a doe only season or two as opposed to bringing back EAB.
