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North lake, Wauk. Cty. Boat launch, WHATS THE HANGUP?

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Flytrap
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6/29/08 4:31 PM CST
I'd say make sure you have somebody to stay with the gear while retrieving the car, or finding a different place to fish. Somehow, I just don't see waiting on the DNR as a viable option. Too much like a political campaign promise, and nobody really believes those.

Of course,you could try to interest a sportsman's organization to fund a boat ramp, but that may be as successful as waiting for the DNR.

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SnakeSter
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6/10/15 6:39 AM CST
Interesting read Guys. One problem I see with this and other government projects is it was said the plan is 8" thick!!!!!!!!! Wow!!!!! Talk about overkill. It's 8" thick because of all the regulations. This makes anything more difficult. How many lawyers did it take to write this plan? At least I'm glad for the Fishermen that want to get on this water.

nihsif
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6/9/15 8:57 AM CST
fair enough, I apologize... this just gets under my skin

the fact of the matter is, if there wasn't the initial complaint way back when, when the site in town was initially chosen... this would have been done years ago

ready to move past it all, thanks

Pearle68
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6/9/15 8:39 AM CST
Start finger pointing - from your post:

"man this project has been a real cluster with the NLMD and their deep pockets and lawyers"

This project was never going to get done on the west shore. Said that from day one and it's been accurate.

I agree it's been a waste of money but some good has come from it - a launch in about 2 years and the end to a DNR practice that has been against the law. And yes, I do have access as does anyone under FOIA.

nihsif
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6/8/15 3:40 PM CST
do we really want to start the finger pointing again? have access to the court documents...

just happy this MAY be getting done before I croak

Pearle68
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6/8/15 10:37 AM CST
The NLMD is pushing forward with permits at the hwy 83 site. The Town of Merton road "Lake Street" dead ends at the site.

The DNR did not follow it's own process for granting itself permits at the other site. The court through those permits out and ordered them to not do that again in the future. This was their common practice. They did that because they could, who would challenge them? People in this case did. If this abuse of power was happening next door to you you'd fight it too.

The launch at the other site was never going to happen. It never was as it didn't have a road and is almost entirely wetland. That's why they didn't follow their own process to get permits.

Now back to what the NLMD has been pushing for 7+ years. The land has been sitting there ready, 50 feet from where the launch had been at Kuchler's resort for many years. Probably a 6 month timeframe from when the permits are approved...

Regardless, there were 10 +/- vehicles/trailers that launched in the river on Saturday. It's not really that difficult...

unclesmallie
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5/28/15 2:04 PM CST
Thank God!!!

nihsif
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5/28/15 10:49 AM CST
was wondering on any progress, so sent email to DNR thru their Contact Us page, and got this reply... man this project has been a real cluster with the NLMD and their deep pockets and lawyers

"The DNR is currently reviewing the waterway permits needed to open a public access site on the northeast shore of North Lake off state Highway 83. This is the site owned by the North Lake Management District. We do not have a date when this decision will be made.

Thanks for your interest.

Kathleen Wolski Public Access Coordinator, DNR Southeast Region 2300 N. M.L. King Dr., Milwaukee WI 53212 "

nihsif
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9/2/14 7:15 PM CST
back to the original plan... the public waits n waits whilst money talks

progress, I guess...and I'm still kickin', maybe I make it out there yet

http://www.livinglakecountry.com/lakecountryreporter/news/north-lake-management-district-launch-site-application-filed-pending-approval-b99340768z1-273215351.html

nihsif
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7/19/14 8:21 AM CST
was for residents, otherwise I would have gone... searched all over for some meeting note, or public account, but found nothing

Chris@MuskyMikes
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7/18/14 1:40 PM CST
Did anyone go to the meeting in late June? I was wondering what the land-owner group was proposing...and if there was any resistance to their plan.

I wouldn't mind reading it either.

nihsif
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6/3/14 3:50 PM CST
nihsif
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5/9/14 11:15 AM CST
you asked about what false testimony... it was outlined in the ruling by the judge

-------property owners lies

" "Boldt noted that an expert witness for the opponents of the boat launch had failed to prove there were "objective characteristics" of a navigable stream within the wetlands.

"Rather, it seems like a fictional construct of a group of nearby private riparian owners who are unhappy to be sharing this area of public waters with a public boat ramp. But the public waters of Wisconsin belong to the residents of the state and are held in trust for all of them, not just lake property owners," Boldt concluded." "

-----

there was "stern" wording by the judge in that part of the case against the property owners for trying to falsify a claim that the DNR property was going to be constructed in a navigable stream

so the property owners constructed a lie...and apparently, the DNR didn't follow some administrative procedure properly

---DNR protocol error

"For the past decade, the NLMD and the Reddelien Road Neighborhood Association (RRND) have been battling the DNR over the development of the site. The DNR previously insisted that the launch be on the west shore of the lake and issued itself the permits necessary for construction of the project.

But Waukesha County Circuit Court Judge Mac Davis ruled last May that those self-issued permits were invalid, reversing two earlier decisions by an administrative law judge that were favorable to the DNR."

---------

I will summarize from my POV

originally, the DNR wanted to put the launch in town, where there was access before...even though that would require expensive dredging from time to time to remove silt carried in by the river

Condominium owners near that site, didn't want to have a launch "in their backyard", so they took the DNR to court...

...DNR acquired the property on Reddelien Road to accommodate the condo property owners, and put in a site that would require less maintenance costs

Property owners at the Reddelien Road site, didn't want to have a launch "in their backyard", so they took the DNR to court...

So, while this was going on for decades...the public was the pawn while the the bullies beat up on each other in court

from my perspective, it boiled down to a battle of will and $$$$, plus having a state representative going after the DNR for spending too much $$$ on the battle took the will from the DNR to continue the battle, plus the anti's finding the right judge...

...and viola! the launch is going in at the original site

score a W for the Reddelien group, and an L for the condo owners

and the public may finally get decent access to North lake after waiting for the giant pissing match to conclude

[This post was last edited on 5/9/14 at 11:17 AM]
Pearle68
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5/8/14 4:25 PM CST
Different case than what I was commenting on. The judge disagreed with their assertions and the manner in which it was collected.

That case ties to the decisive one that I was commenting on in that the DNR and Judge challenged the residents assertion that it was a navigable waterway and the judge ruled that their evidence didn't suffice.

The reason that the DNR lost ultimately is they never did their dilligence prior to applying for and granting themselves a permit. That is why they lost. That is what the DNR has been ordered to never do again.

The DNR and other government entities must be held to the same standards, laws and rules that we are or we will all pay a price. (Even if we like what they are doing!) That's what the decisive case was about.

Thanks for the engagement - fun to argue this over a beer.

nihsif
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5/8/14 12:40 PM CST
I'm sure we would get along just fine.

my post from May 2012

as long as a launch gets built, I'm in no mood for a stupid battle of opinion

as far a easy launching, explain that to any handicapped or limited mobility fishers... I'm sure that they would agree

..................... from May , 2012 ( added some relevant links including the judges ruling )

more on recent ruling

http://www.livinglakecountry.com/lakecountryreporter/news/dnr-wins-a-round-in-north-lake-battle-v45as6s-150799455.html

thought this excerpt from the judge's ruling was interesting:

"Boldt noted that an expert witness for the opponents of the boat launch had failed to prove there were "objective characteristics" of a navigable stream within the wetlands.

"Rather, it seems like a fictional construct of a group of nearby private riparian owners who are unhappy to be sharing this area of public waters with a public boat ramp. But the public waters of Wisconsin belong to the residents of the state and are held in trust for all of them, not just lake property owners," Boldt concluded."

....the fictional construct he was referencing was outlined in item 14 of the official ruling

"The next best effort by the petitioners to identify the area as a stream was present in the testimony of Mr. Reinbold. As Reinbold credibly testified, there is no question that that there has been regular flooding in the area and that water has flowed both away from and toward the lake along a line roughly consistent with that drawn by O'Reilly. But that does not make this area a stream.

Significantly, no aerial photographs were presented that identified a navigable water that presented itself objectively over time nor was any evidence presented to establish a definite stream channel. Rather, historic aerial photos from 1941 to 2010 do not support the existence of a specific flowing stream channel in this area.

Further, the day the kayak was paddled and filmed in the grove of trees, July 15, 2010 , followed a particularly wet month of June and the second highest rain events in July of that year. Ms Hanson testified that she had not previously navigated anywhere on the DNR property. Moreover, Ms. Hansen paddled the area on the specific day that she was directed to by O'Reilly.

Overall, the minimal facts presented do not support a conclusion that a navigable water exists in the grove of trees. Rather, the area meets the legal definition of diffuse surface waters in a floodplain.""

---------more info

EDIT: the judges rulinghttp://media.jsonline.com/documents/northlakeruling.pdf

http://www.jsonline.com/news/waukesha/judge-rejects-bid-to-block-public-access-at-north-lake-i85aios-150504405.html

[This post was last edited on 5/8/14 at 12:53 PM]
Pearle68
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5/8/14 11:48 AM CST
My post is factually correct. I don't know what testimony you're referring to. I've followed this case and I read the ruling by the judge throwing the DNR's permits out and ordering them not to follow that "process" again.

PM me and I'll send you a copy to read.

There is access to North Lake in the river. No state of lawlessness exists. People can and do access the lake every day. It's much easier than the DNR launch on Beaver and, for many, easier than the launch on Oconomowoc.

The launch is closer to opening now that the DNR's permits have been thrown out than it has been for years.

I'll look for you out there when it does

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